With more than half of its staff and leadership ranks women, upstate New York firm Dermody, Burke & Brown has far outpaced many of its fellow CPA firms in establishing a strong female presence — sometimes with a little unintentional help from its lagging peers.
The Syracuse-based firm currently boasts a staff that is 66% women and a partner group that is 61% female (of 90 employees and 18 partners), and more than a few of the recent experienced hires have confided to CEO Madelyn Hornstein that they made the leap after their previous firm did little to advance them.
“We’ve actually reaped the benefits of other firms not getting it,” she shared. “A lot of the higher-level women we have here, there’s no doubt in my mind they should have been partners at other firms. The ‘good old boys’ held them back, and they thought they could get away with holding them back, but they lost.” Hornstein has not only heard this sentiment from the women DB&B has brought onboard, but from those who lost out. “One of the partners of that other firm, he said, ‘Wow, did we mess up. We learned the hard way — we never thought they would have the guts to pick up and go to different firms at their stage in their career. You got a good one.’”
Rising the ranks
Of course, independent of its competitors, DB&B has long cultivated a female-friendly culture over its 66 years in business, which Hornstein credits with her own 39-year rise through ranks: She began her career at the firm fresh out of college and has served as CEO for 13 years.
“I tell people all the time, I didn’t create this culture, but I work really hard to maintain it,” she shared. “It’s been really good for us in attracting and retaining women ... and being family-friendly.”
The firm’s founders had “a ton of children,” according to Hornstein, which set the tone for the culture she has worked hard to maintain. From inception, firm leadership has supported the work-life balance that Hornstein experienced as one of the first female CPAs on the firm’s partner track. After she had her children, “I came back to part-time, maybe three days a week,” Hornstein recalled. “They never put a lot of pressure on me, so I felt I could be a mom, a wife and a CPA that was still on the partner track, all at the same time. Because they were so flexible with me, it just carried on to the next person who came up and started having babies ... and it just kind of grew.”
That flexibility expanded the firm’s ranks of female CPAs to their current numbers. “We’ve also recognized so much that differentiates us from so many CPA firms — the ownership, CEO, CFO, COO, are all women,” Hornstein explained. “That’s just unheard of. We’re not just a good ol’ boys club. It’s definitely a differentiator.”
The firm’s gender ratio attracts not only new talent, but clients, especially women-owned businesses, Hornstein reports: “Women-owned businesses wonder what it’s like to do business with women — it goes back to women helping women, and helping give women a voice. We have to get beyond this idea that they are going to be moms and wives first, and work last. A lot of women really do want to have it all.”
Even with this market differentiator, however, Hornstein shared that in navigating the war for talent, DB&B is making a more proactive effort to publicize its unique story, which so far has elicited “amazing feedback.” Still, Hornstein is under no illusions that the same economic factors that are sending many new hires DB&B’s way — including at least 20 people, eight of them experienced hires, over the last year — may also risk driving them away, regardless of the firm’s sterling retention rates. This is especially true as many other CPA firms enhance their talent efforts in the face of the Great Resignation.
“It’s a little scary for me — our differentiator is going to narrow,” Hornstein acknowledged. “Other people are going to wake up on what they need to remain relevant, to continue to attract and retain talent. They’re not going to have as many people jump ship if they’re not doing what they did all along. For us, we are making sure we make the ones we have happy.”
Inherited trust
One of the keys to this employee satisfaction, Hornstein has found, is the firm’s strong confidence in its people. This trust existed pre-pandemic, she reports, but was only strengthened with more staff taking advantage of remote work. “We have a presumption of trust, that we are all professionals, working hard … that caused people to feel like we respect that they’re professionals and can get the work done,” Hornstein explained.
DB&B continues to offer this flexibility to staff, with Hornstein estimating that around two-thirds of the firm’s workforce comes into the office on a daily basis. But even with the firm’s successful transition, Hornstein does lament some of the post-pandemic changes to daily office life. “It’s hard,” she said. “We always talk about laughter in the hallways, partners keeping their doors open ... We’ve got some of the workforce working from home — do they still feel part of the team? I worry a little about that.”
Assuaging some of that concern is “Dermody Diner,” a marketing-coined portion of the firm’s regular staff meetings when staff can anonymously submit questions to Hornstein on a gamut of topics. Recent questions have focused on the firm’s financials, whether its relaxed dress code will continue (yes), and if the firm could adopt a pet dog (no), among others. “We really want to give people a voice,” Hornstein explained. “It’s a way to bring people together to talk about things that are important to them. We can’t read your minds, so tell us what you’re thinking.”
Hornstein has learned just as much as her employees through this forum, especially about the younger staff members who are so coveted in today’s competitive market. “Young people — and I have three of my own — are not afraid to chase happiness. We have to figure out how to keep them happy.”
